Nothing is Simple Folks

Following from yesterday’s post about how the result affected me comes my own views on why I feel this is not a choice in our best interests. Of course for those in the UK, this is done and that’s that (well for the present, History never stops). This is probably written for those of you who live outside of the UK and are wondering why there is so much fuss.

Just to recap I was on abut reading histories. Not that this means I am an expert or a suitable contributor to worthy journals. However, read enough of it and softly so warnings and lessons seep in. Enough of that diet, with an open mind and notions stick with the reader.

So here is the thing. We in these isles have been linked up with the mainland Europe since before Christ was born. We’ve interfered with them and they with us. We imported kings, we fought wars & we did deals. We stabbed each in the backs, we argued, we fussed, we made up, we stood together, forgot we’d stood together, we worked as one, we worked against each other, we gossiped about each other and our get togethers were fractious; sounds like a large family doesn’t it?

Then in the twentieth century so puffed up with our own collective ideas of omnipotence and manifest destinies we shoved each other too much. and then from 1914 to 1945 (48 if you count the Greek Civil War), we flew at each other. Playing by the old rules, but with new tools. We brought a Hell that put The Thirty Years War in the shade. And we wore ourselves out, then Russia, Last Man Standing was set to play out the last act of the old European Game, but the US now taking up the 19th Century role Britain had been dealing out to the rest of the world back then, said ‘Oh No. That will not suit us at all’.

Well us Europeans are pretty good at building up things out of wreckage, we’ve had about 1500 years’ practice and so by the end of the century, wow everyone except Russia (naturally, that’s how they roll; read their history sometime, it’s a long drama) wanted to be in the Western European club. Lots of cool trade deals, big long roads, flash buildings and money (for most). All built on a tangle of deals, compromises, fudges, rhetoric, lofty ideals, and money-making notions, as well as more quiet destinies; like let’s try and keep it in our own borders folk (France and Britain took some convincing, we’d still got Empire echoes, both of us). Neat, everyone ties up everyone else and no government can play that fast and loose (check on Greece when they tried to, now the ordinary Greeks suffer). Folk could go over the heads of their own governments in some cases and go to Europe to settle their complaint. Rules and Regulations were set up which were concerned more with the person than the current wishes for the ruling party in power. And the best bit, poor regions of nations get money out of the big collective pot. Neat uh?

But now 38.5% of the adult voting nation have decided we can do better on our own. They believe we have the resources to take on the USA, China, Russia, India or whoever else is coming up fast on the horizon. They have an idea 40 years of accumulated legislations and conventions can be dismantled in a steady business-like fashion and we can go our own way. This would be a tough task, and take up much parliamentary time, which means a lot of the usual business will be put on hold. It is fashionable amongst us all to moan about governments and legislations, but in complex societies like ours all that is essential to the day-to-day things you take for granted.

The powers that be with the EU be they governmental, institutional or financial are not happy and they will either want us to get out in haste or drag the heels hoping for something better; indications suggest the former. How many hear have had to quit a home in a hurry for one reason or another? No fun is it?

Within what is currently called The UK, the vote has not been uniform: Let me explain and then add comments:

England: Mostly majorities to Leave; London being singularly wanting to stay. Clue very multi-cultural. The genie of Racism has been let out. It will be difficult to control, particularly as those who voted Leave will expect things to happen quickly.

Scotland: Voted to Remain; the spectre of a second referendum to separate from the rest of the UK is gathering pace.

Northern Ireland: Voted to Remain. It is fair to assume the overwhelming majority of the Nationalist Community voted that way; this sets up another friction point with the Loyalist Community, and those friction points can be deadly. (Despite what some would have you believe Ulster politics is very complex and emotional with TWO very intense sides)

Wales: Apart from one area where Welsh in the First Language Wales voted to Leave. Wales relies on refunding from the EU. Wales will now have to ask the Westminster Parliament if they could give them the money. If the Central Government do, it will come with strings attached…so bye-bye Welsh semi-independence (It’s part of Welsh history; we throw opportunities away. There is a suggestion a welsh prince and his followers landed in North America sometime in the 11th /12th century and founded a colony- then it vanished. As one welsh writer put it; ‘Only The Welsh could discover America and then forget where they’d put it’).

David Cameron has resigned, which means the governing party The Conservatives has to elect a new leader, who will become the Prime Minister. The Conservative Party has a history of toxic battles over European Membership. Whoever may well be Leave, and will of course wish to have like-thinking folk on their side in government. The question will be, are these folk of loyalty or capability?

And where we like it or not, in this world the Commercial Markets and Traders have the final say, and these are institutions who do not like uncertainty, or which there will be plenty.

On the whole, then, so many questions, and all I have heard so far in response in rhetoric and hopes. Well that’s fine; in a film.

I am ready to answer questions from the audience.

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24 thoughts on “Nothing is Simple Folks

  1. Being and independent and conservative soul, I prefer less government to more government. On a purely intellectual level, that would mean that the ‘Leave’ vote eliminates an extra layer of government that sits atop of the British governmental system. Have I stated that properly?

    Liked by 1 person

    • Yes that is a clear and concise conclusion.
      Looking at the matter from a UK perspective and from my own left-wings inclinations are the long term ramifications.
      In practical & historical terms the UK is in a transitory circumstance. Our old position as a prominent voice and influence in the world is in its final stages of decline. Our own natural resources are good but under developed. We are already relying on other nations to enable us to supply energy to the population. We are not equipped to survive as an individual nation without a mammoth social effort as say in WWII; sadly we are a very divided nation and as this matter is an internal matter rather than external also not equipped to the task.
      I am very fond of the USA and the cultural attitude of ‘Hey I can do it!!’ (with emphasis on the ‘I’)…unless we are talking about sport or the arts…that is not something the UK is good at anymore.
      I hope that clarifies the reasons for the concerns I expressed.
      (Actually I would be only to happy to be proven wrong)

      Liked by 1 person

    • On that aspect I wonder what the motivations or reasoning were across the spectrum of the 25% would did not vote.
      Were folk confused by the welter of mostly negative campaigning?
      Was apathy a part?
      I guess there were more than a few who went along with ‘Yeh. Y’know. Whatever,’
      I wonder how that 25% will react as we move into the next stage of leaving?
      Considering the divide not just socially but regionally, this is far from over and I fear not just a case of long complicated negotiations

      Liked by 2 people

  2. I watched the vote being streamed live online by the BBC. I was depressed, but I’m afraid to say not very surprised, by the vote. I follow quite a few British blogs and from the comments some people were making (not at all rabid hothead types), I thought it was very possible that a leave vote was on the cards.

    I worry about the knock-on effects on the rest of the world, of course. Instability is never a good thing. More than that, though, I was sad because from my point of view, it seems that in the UK as in many other countries, people have responded to legitimate grievances arising from globalization and a system that disproportionately rewards the already wealthy, but have blamed all the wrong people for them.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Exactly. They are turning on the people they should seek common cause with.
      The irony being those who wish to leave have opted to remove an elected layer of government and will ultimately replace that with unrepresentative global wide corporations as the UK struggles to become an ‘independent’ trading nation.
      More dangerous are the potential fracture lines both social and regional, looming, while both our main political parties are divided in themselves.

      Liked by 1 person

  3. Hi Roger,
    Thanks again for this second post! You’ve done a fantastic job as usual with teaching your followers.
    I have been following this issue on twitter and have noticed a hashtag called #regrexit.
    Leave it to social media to make something so complex into a hashtag.
    Well I have been reading tweets from UK citizens who are saying that they didn’t fully understand what they were voting for when they voted to leave the EU. They have also been saying that they were misled about the actual ramifications of voting to leave.
    The most troubling piece of information to come from the whole # regret chatter is the fact that in the UK Google saw a major uptick in the search terms “What is the EU?” —AFTER the referendum vote to leave passed. Talk about crazy! That should have been looked up BEFORE the referendum vote don’t you think?

    I haven’t checked the news; actually I avoid it on Sundays. How is the petition for a new referendum going?

    Liked by 1 person

    • Hi Gwin.
      Well it’s all going pretty febrile here. I summarise for you.
      1. Scotland has a semi-independent parliament (a bit like the separate states in the US). The majority of Scots want to stay. Leader of the ruling party; SNP says they will try and veto and exit.
      2. In Northern Ireland there are many applications for Irish (Eire) passports, as NI citizens can have dual citizenship.
      3. The opposition party Labour (not like the Democrats- think more that they would see Bernie Sanders as being a bit to the right ) is now in one of its regular internal vicious fights over what went wrong and time for a new leader.
      4. The petition has reached about 3,000,000 (truth be known it would have to be 5 times that number)
      5. There is a lot of profiling going on, I am in an age group which ‘has sold out the younger generation for its own selfish and petty reasons’ (I need a cool t-shirt ‘Hey 64 & voted Remain…don’t blame me!!)
      And the financial markets don’t like us no more, no how no way.
      I’m not surprised some folk didn’t know what they were letting themselves in for…been here in the 1992 general election…..
      Oh well….thanks for the affirmation.
      Keep on keeping on.
      (Ps send us food parcels?…..snigger)

      Liked by 2 people

      • Good Grief! Sounds like Bedlam! But I see that you are holding on to your great sense of humor 🙂
        Just remember that a lot of us in the US are rooting for the UK to pull through– somehow.
        A “64 and voted remain” T-shirt might not be a bad idea because profiling is running rampant EVERYWHERE. Blaming immigrants was part of the whole motivation for some in the UK to want to leave –right?
        I tell you, we had stabbings in California between Neo-Nazis and some kinda anti-establishment/anarchists.
        I was like what in the fresh hell is going on? Does no one read history anymore?
        Bearing all of this in mind, I’m thinking about taking a page from your book and calling myself WoebegoneAndMoreWoeful!

        Liked by 1 person

      • Awww bless you Gwin, no you stay with your cool name!
        Anyhows; thanks you guys in the US for thinking of us.
        Actually today there is an undercurrent of ‘My God! What have we done?’….A right-wing UK group called ‘Britain First’ (a place where -right-right-wingers go) has put up a site ‘Britain First Against Racism’ which is a glimmer. Because a lot of knuckle-draggers have been posting hate-mail.
        There has been hate simmering across the world (read any news on any country). This is a time to spread The Good Words, Compassion, Tolerance and Respect. It’s important to sometimes take a breath and listen; not easy though.
        Take care Gwin, keep on keeping on.

        Liked by 1 person

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